Take-Two chairman Strauss Zelnick thinks the Grand Theft Auto IV downloadable content came too late after the original game had shipped, making it unable to take adventage of the game's marketing support.
Taking questions after today's financials, Zelnick said, "Both we and Microsoft believed there was a big market for GTA IV episodic content and some factors affected their performance.
"Both were released significantly after the launch of the core unit and therefore weren't able to leverage GTA IV's initial marketing campaign and initial launch fervor."
GTA IV: The Ballad of Gay Tony
Official trailer
1:11Base jumping video
GTA IV: The Ballad of Gay Tony
Official trailer
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I think the main problem wasn't the fact the DLC was so late but because most people who played the game didn't bother to finish it. I've seen tons of people achevements on it and most aren't that far into it and haven't played it for a long time. Most of mates didn't bothered to finish it.
I finished the game with exception of killing the seagulls/pigeons etc, then I finished the lost and damned, but as good as gay tony looks! I just can't get into it! and I love GTA aswell! think maybe cos its the same city with new people! and I have maybe seen enough of the same old landmarks etc! dunno just feels old now! NEW GTA please
I relate to some of the comments on here. I have the main game of GTA IV and to this day I've only started the demo at the start of the game where you learn to drive. I have so many other games to play as well and the list of highly anticipated games for 2010 is not going to help on that count.
I do want to play GTA IV and complete it but as an adult man with a fulltime job who takes care of his responsibilities and duties, I find it difficult to find enough time to play all the games I already own in a satisfactory manner (I prefer not to rush). I am concerned that GTA IV will be another Oblivion; beautiful and massive yet even after two-three years I still haven't actually completed Oblivion despite downloading hundreds of mods for it and building a tank character. Oblivion was just too open-ended for my tastes (and I do like open-ended games) and I ended up watching the end on a YouTube clip. GTA IV may end up facing a similar fate.
It should go without saying that I have little interest in purchasing any of the DLC for GTA IV when I have barely even scratched the surface of the main game. Granted, I was a late buyer of GTA IV, yet that would only have made the DLC seem closer to "release day" from my purchase date. I'm not interested in the slightest and I think the DLC came out too late to capitalize on initial fervor.
Maybe because GTA IV wasn't all that its cracked up to be and that really, the Lost and Damned DLC was rather sh*t? Seriously, GTA IV is a flash in the pan game. It sold on its name alone...
KFD, I advise you to watch the ending on Youtube as its not worth going through all of the game to see it
To be honest with you, I'd have to wonder if all the people that bought San Andreas actually completed it? - I know I didn't (it's the one GTA that I didn't enjoy).
Actually, same goes for Vice City - I've beaten it nearly 3 times and it's easily one of my favourite games of all time, but pretty much everyone else I know hasn't. So, I'm not sure you can really level that criticism purely at GTA4.
I just want to know where they're sending the series next - wherever it is, I'll be buying it.
They just weren't ambitious enough is my thoughts on it.
I remember them saying how they struggled to fit everything in Vice City onto DVD yet a couple of years later San Andreas came out and then GTA4.
KFD with regards not completing GTA4 or GTASA. My girlfriend did both (no cheats or assistance from me) within about 4 months of each other and she has a full time job with resposibilities. Man up.
I'm in the same boat as KFD. I have a wife and two young children, we both work full-time. So when I do get half hour or a couple of hours to go on their I normally just play a few games on PES. But I did start doing a few missions on GTA IV each time and found it to be really enjoyable.
GTA IV is an amazing piece of development, the city is very impressive. With so much attention to detail, even now I'm always impressed with how believable and immerse it is. The missions are so varied and there is so much to do.
I must admit that I lost interest for a while after the first few missions, but now I've got back into it I'm enjoying it more than any other GTA. I love the gritty realism of Niko's story and the missions are great but many longed for that fun element of San Andreas. So maybe if Gay Tony had been released first, and within 7 months of GTA's release i.e. end of November 08 - it would have been huge and people may have held on to their copies instead of trading in. Those that did have lost out on an outstanding game, a poignant title in the series that will be remembered as a classic and a masterpiece in game design!
Cheers fellas. I may just look up the ending on YouTube...but only after making a concerted effort to finish the game! This is my last work day of the year and I won't be returning to work until Jan. 4th, 2010! Yiipee!
@starvinbull: Damn man. The gauntlet has been thrown and now my gaming honour is at stake it would seem!
There was plenty of advertising on T.V to be fair for the DLC packs, and how many other games have had that for their DLC? It may be partly down to timing but also perhaps the GTA market isn't one that is suited to down loadable content. Also as people have said it is a BIG game that many people haven't completed it or have so much to do in the main game they don't see a need for additional content.
@ KFD: I Know what you mean, Having to work 5 days a week, spend time with the wife & daughter as well as other things that need doing for home life it does make time to fit all these games in tough. Having the four platforms PC/XBOX/PS3/WII and all my retro systems its bloody hard to fit all the great releases in...
To be honest, the main game doesn't take that long to do. You should see the ending in no time.
Parma, I've been trying to tell you how much TCV rocked but I'm not sure if you saw my post on Tuesday (FFXIII 1 million copies thread and was the only time I've posted this week). They were simply brilliant
To be honest, the main game doesn't take that long to do. You should see the ending in no time.
Parma, I've been trying to tell you how much TCV rocked but I'm not sure if you saw my post on Tuesday (FFXIII 1 million copies thread and was the only time I've posted this week). They were simply brilliant
Yeah. No surprise really, those guys have about 80 years experience between them.
It was a bit wierd watching them on Jonathan Ross, I must admit. Well, what I managed to hear - I had some drunk friend trying to make sure they were centre of attention that night....he only really seemed to talk to Dave Grohl though - did he not realise that there was a member of Led Zeppelin sitting there?
anyone who calls themself a gamer and hasnt finished IV should be shot.
people complaining about GTA's length, are also complaining about MW2's shortness.
saying you dont have time is NONSENSE! you have a 2 or 3 year window to complete it until the next GTA. games save, you can pick it up mission after mission. you dont need to finish it in one sitting.
Yeah. No surprise really, those guys have about 80 years experience between them.
It was a bit wierd watching them on Jonathan Ross, I must admit. Well, what I managed to hear - I had some drunk friend trying to make sure they were centre of attention that night....he only really seemed to talk to Dave Grohl though - did he not realise that there was a member of Led Zeppelin sitting there?
Yeah, Dave normally does a lot of talking anyway but Wossy probably only favoured him cos he was pressed for time and had met him a few times already. Still though, that's not an excuse
It was pretty much all Josh though at the gig. Can't wait to see them again in the future. Norah Jones is next for me currently
anyone who calls themself a gamer and hasnt finished IV should be shot.
people complaining about GTA's length, are also complaining about MW2's shortness.
saying you dont have time is NONSENSE! you have a 2 or 3 year window to complete it until the next GTA. games save, you can pick it up mission after mission. you dont need to finish it in one sitting.
In that case I suspect a great many gamers will be lying a pool of their own blood since that is a matter of opinion and it is entirely likely other gamers think that other gamers should be shot for not playing "Game X", etc.
I don't mind GTA IV being a long game (I like to feel that I'm getting my money's worth), yet in order to stay focused the scripting needs to be kept tight - at least to a certain extent. That is the conundrum between open ended gaming worlds and plot driven interaction.
You are correct that one does not have to play through a game in one sitting. Personally I prefer to play games the way I read books, which is to say one at a time until completion. Sure, I have switched back and forth from multiple books, yet I did not derive quite the same amount of immersion, understanding and satisfaction as I seem to do when I focus on one book exclusively. The same goes for games. I prefer to keep the story fresh and it's pacing uninterrupted by long sabbaticals.
I never finished it am I not a "true" gamer? But I did smash Virtua Fighter 5 and even went to Japan to play it. You sound like the kind of person that plays mainstream games and thinks he's hardcore.
1) How many shields did you have to hit in "Skool Daze" on the spectrum. 2) On the Atari ST, how many Plat albums did you need to complete "Rockstar ate my hamster"? 3) In the "King of Fighters", which of the four elements come to mind when you think of the Character, Mai? 4) In Daytona USA, what was the name of the beginner track? 5) What chartacter from Virta Fighter 3, was dropped from the line up in VF 4 and VF4 evo, but has made a come back in Virtua Fighter 5-R?
If you go around telling people they are not "true" gamers as you put it, then I expect you could answer these questions without any trouble, besides you MUST be hardcore......
I actually agree with SVD on this one. GTA4 was one of the only games this gen that I didn't feel ripped off.
The single player was really meaty and had a really good, well paced story. The multiplayer, although not up there with halo, cod and gears had amazing variety.
In terms of DLC, maybe they came too late, but the length before release goes to show that they had not produced it alongside the main game to add on for more profit later. Lost and Damned was great, but I haven't gone back to Ballad, the ridiculous plot doesn't fit with me in this iteration of GTA. I'll go back and finish it but I'm not enjoying it as much as the others.
Now, Red Dead Redemption looks to be the next big meaty game, I hope it takes me as long to complete. Short games suck balls.
I never finished it am I not a "true" gamer? But I did smash Virtua Fighter 5 and even went to Japan to play it. You sound like the kind of person that plays mainstream games and thinks he's hardcore.
1) How many shields did you have to hit in "Skool Daze" on the spectrum. 2) On the Atari ST, how many Plat albums did you need to complete "Rockstar ate my hamster"? 3) In the "King of Fighters", which of the four elements come to mind when you think of the Character, Mai? 4) In Daytona USA, what was the name of the beginner track? 5) What chartacter from Virta Fighter 3, was dropped from the line up in VF 4 and VF4 evo, but has made a come back in Virtua Fighter 5-R?
If you go around telling people they are not "true" gamers as you put it, then I expect you could answer these questions without any trouble, besides you MUST be hardcore......
There's hardcore gamer and then there's niche. I wonder if someone levelled equally obtuse questions at you you'd flounder too?
I never finished it am I not a "true" gamer? But I did smash Virtua Fighter 5 and even went to Japan to play it. You sound like the kind of person that plays mainstream games and thinks he's hardcore.
1) How many shields did you have to hit in "Skool Daze" on the spectrum. 2) On the Atari ST, how many Plat albums did you need to complete "Rockstar ate my hamster"? 3) In the "King of Fighters", which of the four elements come to mind when you think of the Character, Mai? 4) In Daytona USA, what was the name of the beginner track? 5) What chartacter from Virta Fighter 3, was dropped from the line up in VF 4 and VF4 evo, but has made a come back in Virtua Fighter 5-R?
If you go around telling people they are not "true" gamers as you put it, then I expect you could answer these questions without any trouble, besides you MUST be hardcore......
There's hardcore gamer and then there's niche. I wonder if someone levelled equally obtuse questions at you you'd flounder too?
Yeah, like what underpants was I wearing when I completed The Last Ninja on the commodore 64 or what flavour packet of crisps was I eating when I finally got Sam topless on Sam Fox Strip Poker?
GTAIV is a masterpiece. its length should be no obstacle. all GTAs were massive. i suspect people didnt get their cheesy jetpacks and 'fun' items from san-an and gave up half way through. its a much deeper game, you just need to get into it.
the physics are class, anything can happen in this game. its madness, but on a more sophisticated level.
To be honest with you, I'd have to wonder if all the people that bought San Andreas actually completed it? - I know I didn't (it's the one GTA that I didn't enjoy).
Actually, same goes for Vice City - I've beaten it nearly 3 times and it's easily one of my favourite games of all time, but pretty much everyone else I know hasn't. So, I'm not sure you can really level that criticism purely at GTA4.
I just want to know where they're sending the series next - wherever it is, I'll be buying it.
See, Vice city absolutely rocks and probably one of my favourite games ever too. Its the music and story that made it for me.
although, Im quite sad and completed it, and San andreas and two games on the PSP to 100%.
Although, im still only 30% through GTA IV, but there is no rush, but id still get the DLC if they released it on PS3.
The game sold well on the PS3, so for me its no wonder the DLC didnt perhaps sell as well as they hoped, if they thought that more people would buy the game on 360.
DLC exclusive may sway a few, but it was never going to be the sole reason for shifting 360's, even for the biggest GTA fans.
Cheers fellas. I may just look up the ending on YouTube...but only after making a concerted effort to finish the game! This is my last work day of the year and I won't be returning to work until Jan. 4th, 2010! Yiipee!
@starvinbull: Damn man. The gauntlet has been thrown and now my gaming honour is at stake it would seem!
Darn tooting.
To put into context she is a woman who's fave games of this year have been proffessor layton and the new zelda. You're gonna think I'm bulls**tting but I'm not.
GTAIV is a masterpiece. its length should be no obstacle. all GTAs were massive. i suspect people didnt get their cheesy jetpacks and 'fun' items from san-an and gave up half way through. its a much deeper game, you just need to get into it.
the physics are class, anything can happen in this game. its madness, but on a more sophisticated level.
I have played through GTA4 twice now and I think I enjoyed it as much as you by the sound of your posts, but that doesn't change the fact some people never complete a GTA story, the worlds are filled with so much to do without ever taking a mission. I doubt half the people that bought the game have finished the story and I bet quite a few of them have never left the first island.
That's the problem with this DLC, while I myself want to experience more story from the game and play as a different character in the same world a lot wont, anyone that buys the game to mess around will have no interest in the DLC.
The DLC been exclusive was the main problem, it didn't come too late, it was just offered to too small of a potential userbase. The timing was just right really, just like the old expansion packs for PC games back in the day.
Yeah, like what underpants was I wearing when I completed The Last Ninja on the commodore 64 or what flavour packet of crisps was I eating when I finally got Sam topless on Sam Fox Strip Poker?
GTAIV is a masterpiece. its length should be no obstacle. all GTAs were massive. i suspect people didnt get their cheesy jetpacks and 'fun' items from san-an and gave up half way through. its a much deeper game, you just need to get into it.
the physics are class, anything can happen in this game. its madness, but on a more sophisticated level.
I have played through GTA4 twice now and I think I enjoyed it as much as you by the sound of your posts, but that doesn't change the fact some people never complete a GTA story, the worlds are filled with so much to do without ever taking a mission. I doubt half the people that bought the game have finished the story and I bet quite a few of them have never left the first island.
That's the problem with this DLC, while I myself want to experience more story from the game and play as a different character in the same world a lot wont, anyone that buys the game to mess around will have no interest in the DLC.
The DLC been exclusive was the main problem, it didn't come too late, it was just offered to too small of a potential userbase. The timing was just right really, just like the old expansion packs for PC games back in the day.
The whole deal was just a waste of time. The content wasn't worth the wait and the exclusivity choked the life out of it.
Yeah, like what underpants was I wearing when I completed The Last Ninja on the commodore 64 or what flavour packet of crisps was I eating when I finally got Sam topless on Sam Fox Strip Poker?
Oh look, another "GTA wasn't as good as they said it would be" thread.
GTAIV was awesome. I finished it 100%, just like SA before it & VC before that. Great games & the DLC was excellent too. Real bargains for the amount of gameplay & fun you had.
The DLC was too late, I said it on here many a time while we were waiting for it. People forgot about the game & weren't hyped about it when it eventually came out. I guess that's what happens when a dev starts work on the DLC after the game is out, instead of developing it alongside the game (which everyone moans about because "it should be on the disc".
People should give GTAIV & R* more credit. They created a masterpiece with GTAIV. With the various physics engines etc at work, it really is a fun sandbox to f**k about in. The hard work has been done now though, the engine has been made, I expect big things for the next GTA using this engine.
R* also set a new benchmark for DLC. No mucking about. A full on 10 hour campaign with new multiplayer modes, vehicles, guns et al. Most devs probably would have split it all up & sell it to you a car at a time.
But hey, it's cool to knock things that are popular right?
Technically, GTA IV was a brilliant game, it just wasn't fun to play.
I found it far more enjoyable than San Andreas... they tried to put too many "new" features into that which just got in the way of the storyline... learning skills etc.
Well of course the obvious answer is that they were way too late!
IV came out in April 2008 - LatD was planned for October, a mere 6 months after, and for something as big as it promised to be, it was plenty because GTA IV had a long story and is content rich so you'd probably be ok with that.
But nearly a whole year later and then a further 8 months to complete and release the second DLC? Come on...Timing IS everything.
However, IF the DLC packs came out for PS3 I'd probably get them!
I think T2 made a big mistake allowing the DLC to be an XBOX exclusive. Bearing in mind loads of people really, really wanted to play this on playstation. The GTA franchise was originally always more of a playstation thing so they might have shot themselves in the foot long term with that. COD and Unchartered developers took the majority of disgruntled fans.
Another point is that friends recommend games regardless of console. Word of mouth is by far the biggest and best form of marketing. This also kepp a game's shelflife longer. If you take out half the market plus people that dont have online access your not letting people who want your game to have it.
But hey, it's cool to knock things that are popular right?
Says the guy doing rage against xfactor lol.
So are you agreeing with me then?
Yes and no.
The game isn't better than LBP, Fable 2, Uncharted 1 or 2 so yes the reviews were a little OTT but the technology and audio work in it are pretty unparralelled in games.
I can't say it isn't a great game because it is.
Oh and rage against xfactor, yeh I'd happily see things shaken up a little. Hope it gives publicity to alternatives and diverts money destined to fatten cowell's swollen wallet.
i bought gta4 expecting big things, and was very disappointed to be honest. i loved the other gta's before it, especially 3 and vice city (san andreas was just too big). this one just fell short of my expectations. i found the missions very repetitive and tiresome, and to be honest i havent played it for ages. i do believe it is over hyped and it definately is not one of the best games this generation. for me, that honour goes to either oblivion or bioshock, though i havent played uncharted 2 yet so that could be a worthy contender. i'm not bottomd about the gta4 dlc. if they're as repetitive as the original game then maybe it's a good thing they didnt come to ps3...cos i wouldnt have bought them. i bet microsoft regret that £50 million payout for exclusive dlc now >D
People knock GTA4 all the time, for me it's one of the best videogames I've ever played and Rockstar are one of the only developers not trying to make a monkey out of the consumer. Even Valve have started erring on the the side of dodgy. The controversy for L4D2 may have subsided but for me the sequel does suffer from feeling too damn similar to the prequel, for a company that takes so long over games usually, they have gone 180 and done a fifa. And now they're already pitching DLC for it? Hmm.
It may have been late from a strictly business point of view but I'd much rather that than a month or two.
But hey, it's cool to knock things that are popular right?
Says the guy doing rage against xfactor lol.
So are you agreeing with me then?
Yes and no.
The game isn't better than LBP, Fable 2, Uncharted 1 or 2 so yes the reviews were a little OTT but the technology and audio work in it are pretty unparralelled in games.
I can't say it isn't a great game because it is.
Oh and rage against xfactor, yeh I'd happily see things shaken up a little. Hope it gives publicity to alternatives and diverts money destined to fatten cowell's swollen wallet.
Yeah purely subjective as is the nature of the beach....but fable 2, really? That was a glitchy, obviously rushed piece of software that was nowhere near what ol' Moleneux had stated it would be. In comparison GTA was much better realised.
That Joe puppet has never even heard the Rage song before...for that alone he should be shot.
If you're to have a career in music you're supposed to know a bit about it.
As far as I was aware Rage are quite an important an influencial band.
I'm sick of the whole xploitation factor thing and hated it since it started...the fact that a Rage song has a chance of beating it to number one means the masses are finally starting to get sick of it, or are just in need of another shephard.
With the DLC been 360 only you of course will get less sales. As much as I love R* maybe this will give them a wake up call. GTA 4 is not the best thing ever it is infact the worse in the series.
Sure the DLC is fun but with 4 been pants people will be less inclined to buy the DLC.
I don''t think being late was the problem, I think it was because people don't buy GTA games for the missions (or at least I don't) and that was pretty much all that the DLC added. I'd have been more interested in new parts of the map(countryside would be nice), a 7th wanted level, more game modes (I'd love to see a GTA take on Horde mode), the crazier cheats and vehicles from SA making a comeback (without having to mess around with a mobile) etc. On top of this, the DLC was 360 only(not a problem for me but it will have been for alot of GTA fans).
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