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The Duke Case
The Duke Case

Jami Floyd discusses the first reports of the dropping of the rape charges

Dec. 22, 2006

Jami Floyd: Hello, y'all.

Jami Floyd: Bye bye, Duke.

Court TV Host: I'm sure you all want to discuss the latest Duke bombshell...

Question from ctv_warhorse2: For those who don't know, would you explain the difference between the charges of sexual assault & rape? What are your thoughts on Nifong dropping the rape charges in the Duke case?

Jami Floyd: It's all about penetration. Tell me if you need to hear more, and I don't know that he's dropped all the charges. Current reports are that he's dropping the "rape" charges - still can be a sexual assault case, as well as kidnapping and the rest.

Question from Guyin50s: No, stop!

Jami Floyd: LOL No worries - no need to be overly detailed, but I do think ultimately he may drop the whole dang thing. And remember, this is all currently just according to the defense attorney.

Question from Guyin50s: Current reports are that he is maintaining the charges of assault and kidnapping.

Jami Floyd: That's what we are reporting as well.

Question from Q_laughin_All_da_Way: Jami, since the rape charges against the two were dropped, do you not think that the attorneys and the DA agreed for the rape to be discharged and the others to be left on?

Jami Floyd: No, I don't think they've agreed on ANYthing in this case. I think what's happened in this case is the accuser is uncertain about penetration. I don't think it's about deal making at this point.

Question from Guyin50s: Jami_Floyd, is there any evidence or report that a plea bargain is in the works as Q_laughin_All_da_Way has been saying?

Question from ctv_warhorse2: Is there a plea deal offered in the Duke case? Some of our chatters are saying there is.

Jami Floyd: We have no information that suggests a plea deal in this case. As far as our reporting goes, there has never been a deal on the table. The two sides aren't communicating yet, again, according to our sources on both sides, and again, we're hearing that this current decision (if true -- still working on confirmation) is owing to the problems with the accuser, not any conversations between lawyers for the boys and the DA.

Question from Merry: Is the kidnapping charge about holding her against her will?

Jami Floyd: Yes, that is precisely it. We often think of kidnapping as taking someone in a car or van and transporting them somewhere against their will, but it can be simply HOLDING someone against their will, similar to false imprisonment but with force. So yes, that's it in this case. News conference is gonna happen in Duke in a minute so keep it tuned to CTV while we're chatting.

Question from Eagle: If money were offered to the alleged victim and she went willingly, how can that be construed to be kidnapping?

Jami Floyd: Good question. The kidnapping doesn't happen until she wants to leave. So she comes to the party. She's paid. She is there willingly, but when she wants to leave, and especially when she's confined to that bathroom, then the kidnapping kicks in. Similar to rape and prostitution: the minute the woman's intentions change, so too does the legal definition of what's going on. I'm thinking here Nifong will argue (assuming it goes forward) that she was kidnapped, insofar as she was held against her will in the bathroom, but not as to her general presence in the house as a whole.

Question from Justice_Watcher171: Did they take a rape kit for the case?

Jami Floyd: Yes. It was done by a nurse who specializes in taking them at the hospital.

Question from Justice_Watcher171: I have a question. I am curious, since the rape charges are dropped, if they are convicted of the charges that are still pending, how long will they be put in prison?

Jami Floyd: Remember, we don't know for sure the rape charges have been dropped. We are hearing reports from the DEFENSE that Nifong is gonna (or has) dropped some of the charges. We haven't seen any court papers to confirm, nor has Nifong's office confirmed, so we're still working on it. Now, to answer your question, rape in NC is punishable by life in prison BUT unlike in other crimes like drug offenses judges have a lot of discretion and if the rape charge falls away then we'll be talking something less than life (though still very heavy sentences for sexual assault).

Question from TinseledTrisha: Will the dropping of the rape charges nullify the order for the paternity test?

Jami Floyd: Ashleigh just asked that very question on the air, and, yes, I would think the judge will deny that motion now that penetration is not an issue. Again, if it is confirmed that the rape charges will be dropped

Question from Ashley: Have you heard anything about the birth of the alleged victim's new child?

Jami Floyd: Lets see, last Thursday we reported that she'd had the baby. Since then, the only thing I've heard on that front is the news about the defense motion for the paternity test. AND a source close to the accuser saying the baby is NOT the child of any of the accused. That source says she knows who the father is. That's all I got.

Question from Guyin50s: Genetic material from other males was found on her person ... have those other males been identified yet?

Jami Floyd: Some have, but not publicly, because of concerns for their privacy, and others have not yet been identified. But the defendants have all been excluded from those samples.

Question from Cambra: Would you expect a civil suit to follow if the criminal charges are dropped?

Jami Floyd: That's a good question, but I'm thinking no here, even though everyone seems to sue over everything. I get the sense that this accuser is not in it for money. She's been so very private about the whole thing, and she hasn't filed yet. Add to that, the dismissal you posit, and she loses the foundation for a civil suit So no, I think this whole ugly incident may just go away.

Question from kiara: Jami, do the Duke guys have any legal recourse to recoup legal monies?

Question from Guyin50s: Jami_Floyd, if all charges eventually are dropped, will the lacrosse players have a case against Nifong for malicious prosecution?

Jami Floyd: Guyin50s question answers kiara's question, in part. DAs have immunity from suits based on the charges they bring, unless malicious prosecution can be proved, and that is a very, very high and specific standard. They'd have to show that the charges were entirely false (not just unproveable in court, but FALSE) AND that Nifong KNEW they were false and proceeded anyway. So it puts them in the position of proving the rape did not occur, that nothing even CLOSE to a rape occurred, and then they have to prove that Nifong knew it. Don't think they can make that proof.

Question from kiara: Jami, does the alleged Duke rape victim face the possibility of any fraud charges?

Jami Floyd: Boy oh boy, you are a smart crowd: really putting me to the test today! Fraud, that's another thing that is not so easy to prove. It requires the specific intent to defraud someone out of SOMETHING. So first, she has to be lying, that is, she has to have made up the WHOLE THING, not just the rape part. Then she has to have done so to gain something (most states require some sort of financial motive). Of course that takes us back to the civil lawsuit, but remember, for fraud, the state would have to PROVE all of this. And making the proof about intent is difficult without some independent evidence (i.e., the filing of a civil suit). So no, I don't think any fraud. There are some states that make it a crime to file false charges, most states, in fact, but, like perjury it's rarely prosecuted, and i don't know if NC is one of those states

Question from Merry: Is it true that it was not until yesterday that the DA's office talked with the accused?

Jami Floyd: Do you mean accused or accuser? They hadn't talked to the accuser until yesterday, and all conversations with the accused have been with attorneys present, and the most recent one dates back to much closer in time to the incident. Hope that helps.

Question from wendy: Jami, do you think Nifong will actually concede to the fact that there is no evidence ?

Jami Floyd: No, never. It will always be about the defense lawyers, and how they wrecked the case, and the victim's fear of the bad publicity etc. He'll never come out and admit that he had a bad case. Never.

Question from defenseantiprosecutor: How's this going to affect other females coming forward in the future who actually have been raped?

Jami Floyd: Great point! And perhaps the most important lesson from this case, women who cry rape, hurt other women who are raped. Now, let me be clear: I think SOMEthing happened here, but I don't think there is a provable case of rape. If only Nifong could have kept it quiet until he knew he had, or didn't have a case. Now, as you suggest, the message is sent: don't report rape, don't press charges, because you'll never win. That's the message here. It was the message in Kobe and William Kennedy Smith, and it's tragic.

Question from socal: Hi Jami when I saw the end of your show and saw that Mel Sachs had died I was floored. When and how did he die?

Jami Floyd: He died in the last month or so, maybe a bit longer. We were shocked as well. He died very suddenly from an undiagnosed medical condition. He left behind a wife and two young children. We were very saddened but found solace in his life well lived. He did more in his short life than most of us would do in three. He will be missed.

Question from tara: Hi Jami, Merry Christmas, what is your pick of the case for 2006?

Jami Floyd: So tough. We did our best Best Defense moments today and picking those was very hard we had a list of FIFTEEN things, but then we took non-trials off the table: so no Duke, no Entwistle, no Scooter Libby, no Hamdan, since none of those were trials, no, "If I Did It" for the same reason, though I LOVE that story and the "Million Little Pieces" debacle as well. I love Cody Posey, loved the way Court TV viewers, who usually come down with the state, rallied behind him, especially given that there was NO DOUBT he killed those people. Loved McCowen for the mystery of it all. I really loved the priest who was on trial for killing the nun all those years before - didn't rate well - but the facts were FASCINATING. I know I'm hedging, but that's the best I can do. The biggest legal story of the year, however, has to be the new Supreme Court because unlike most of what we do on Court TV, what the high court does affects us all!

Court TV Host: Thanks, Jami! See you next year!

Court TV Host: Happy holidays and happy new year!

Jami Floyd: Thanks to all of you for a terrific year (my first full year back at Court TV), it's all about our viewers, and all of you online, and we want you to know that we know that! So Happy Holidays! And here's to a wonderful 2007 for all...

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